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Post by coastalman on Aug 15, 2021 21:04:48 GMT -5
Hi, I'm brand new to the forum and am looking for some information on a pistol that my wife's father obtained in WWII. He was handed this gun by a German officer who surrendered to him. The serial number is 18811. It does have the FN name on it and also has d'armes de guerre and HERSTAL BELGIQUE stamped on it. Any information, or a direction to look for the information would be much appreciated. It does not have the German marking on it.
Thanks,
Charlie
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Post by tnorris on Aug 15, 2021 21:31:03 GMT -5
Hello!
You have probably found the right place.
General pictures of the pistol and detailed pics of any and all markings would help. We want to see what sights it has (tangent sights marked for 1000 m or 500m or later sights); what both sides look like; any stamped letter below an asterisk; does it have a magazine disconnect, etc... if you begin with a few clear photos, whomever sees them first can tell you what else they would like to see!
Cheers,
Tim
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Post by coastalman on Aug 16, 2021 6:55:24 GMT -5
I'm trying to figure out how to post pictures. I'll do so soon.
Charlie
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Post by coastalman on Aug 16, 2021 7:22:59 GMT -5
In the help guide, it says I need to have the support staff to allow me to post pictures. So far, I can't find a way to ask them for that. Sorry to be so ignorant. I do have pictures, but am not able to attach them at this time.
Charlie
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Post by tnorris on Aug 16, 2021 7:59:03 GMT -5
Hmmm... there may be a restriction for new members?
I can PM you if you would like to send pix to me via email.
Cheers,
Tim
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Post by Bob Reed on Aug 16, 2021 10:27:32 GMT -5
Hello, Charlie, We don't have much photo storage space here on the forum, but you should be able to post photos by following Todd's directions near the bottom of this thread. highpowercollectors.proboards.com/thread/998/general-newsBTW: Do you happen to know what Division the German Officer was in, and the location where the gun was acquired? Good Luck and Thanks, |
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Post by coastalman on Aug 16, 2021 11:32:32 GMT -5
My wife thinks Germany, but, many years ago when we first talked about the gun, I seem to remember that Italy was mentioned. No one knows what division of the German military it was. Her father was in the Coast Guard and Merchant Marine most of his life so it may be water related. Just don't know.
Charlie
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Post by coastalman on Aug 16, 2021 11:35:27 GMT -5
Tim, my email address is covercash1@aol.com I will be glad to send you the pictures. By the way, the pistol has a grove in the handle that I believe is for a stock to be attached to the pistol.
Charlie
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Post by coastalman on Aug 21, 2021 16:58:32 GMT -5
With Tim's help we have determined that the pistol is a 1938 make with a 50-500 range rear sight and a slot for a stock.
Charlie
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Post by tnorris on Aug 22, 2021 9:19:58 GMT -5
With Tim's help we have determined that the pistol is a 1938 make with a 50-500 range rear sight and a slot for a stock. Charlie
Taking into consideration much of what I think we know about FN serial number reliability, the "parts baskets", etc; and after looking through the Vanderlinden and Stevens books for clues:
My best guess - 1938 (ish) Pre-War Belgian Military contract High Power???
-SN 18,811 seems to be in the range for 1938-'40 pistols
-Controller of Proof mark used by Woit Nicolas Cominoto from 1911-1940 -no German Proof marks
-no foreign contract marks (Finnish contract fits SN and time range)
-it seems to have a complete set of Belgian proofs - Belgian Military contract?
-Type 1 500m tangent sights for pistols supplied with a numbered shoulder stock
-arsenal acceptance mark used on High Powers from 1935-1940 (PH below a crown) -"Parts Inspector" marks. Circle/H was active from 1931- early 1940. -round barrel cam - changed to squared in 1938 Is this a clue - there is the number 8 on the front right side of the trigger guard. This is a location where I look for a date code on HPs from '52 and after... it seems to be upside down and on the left side on several 1950 pistols I have seen.
That's about as far as I can go... who else here can help decipher the clues of this pistol? Were there clear date codes on pre-war pistols?
I may look to other FN pistols to find out.
Cheers, Tim I have some other photos from Charlie. If someone would like to see them for further clues, I can post or provide them to you. Perhaps Charlie will be able to provide specific images if you ask... I can upload the here if need be.
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Post by ToddSig on Aug 22, 2021 10:23:58 GMT -5
Nice detective work Tim, and nice looking High Power Charlie.
Tim covers most of the important markings and has narrowed the date range down. As Tim points out there is an H within a circle on the slide, trigger and frame. This mark reinforces/confirms Tim's finding that the pistol was from a pre-war Belgium military FN contract. The H in a circle is an arsenal inspectors (one of many) parts mark for Belgium military contract guns. The H in a circle is for Belgian military part acceptances and was used, as noted circa 1931-1940.
Additionally, the PH under a crown in an oval, this was also a military acceptance mark, and is found on Belgian military contract High Powers dating from 1935-1940.
Given what Tim has discovered as well as the two MAE (La Manufacture d'Armes de l'Etat de Liege/State arms manufacturer) marks listed above, I think you can be confident it is from an FN Belgium military contract pre 1940.
(Edit - just saw Tim had noted the PH under a crown mark as well, most of my post is duplicative)
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Post by Bob Reed on Aug 22, 2021 11:59:14 GMT -5
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