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Post by dirtniron on Jul 17, 2021 9:01:25 GMT -5
Fellow members, if you could help with this serial number to date.
Purchase new in about 1974, a Hi-Power serial number T2859XX. This number does not exist on any of the charts that I have referenced that stop at about T258XXX. I understand that 1969 was a transition time to convert the "T" format.
Forward left side of trigger guard has a "5". Opposite on the forward right side is the proof that matches the barrel at the ejection port that I describe as a horizontal oval, crown on top, a P and V inside separated by an arrow, with chevrons at base. On left side of slide is the Browning St Louis / Montreal and made in Belgium stampings
Yes, a beautifully made piece that is my favorite 'combat' pistol. I also have a German era one as well as a "thumbprint" C 1954 one. These Hi-Powers fit my hand well and the sights site much lower than the M 1911.
Any help on date of manuf. would help since the bill of sale is not accurate enough. Thank you.
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Post by ToddSig on Jul 17, 2021 10:14:34 GMT -5
Hey dirtniron, and welcome to High Power Collectors. AS you have discovered, the Browning serial number chart is not correct, and T Series Hi Powers, for both Browning Hi Powers and FN High Powers ran until the early 1970s and well into the high T300000 range. I have a surplus T with a T377390, which I date to 1972 based on some part production numbers. From your stated serial number of T2859XX I would guess 1969. You can check some of the parts for production dates. Not all have them, but for a late 1960s and 1970s mark, it would be a single digit number with diamond shaped lines around the number, or portions of. The number represents the part production date, the lines for the quarter of that year. You can look on the mag if original, try looking on the hammer, the back of the slide stop, base of the grip, the foot of the barrel and on the underside of the slide on the firing pin block. Productions marks are not always found, but typically you will find one or two of them. I have always had best luck on the barrel foot. Keep in mind these are part production date, and the assembly/serial numbering would be a bit later. Hope this helps, and let us know what you find or post some images of the marks you find. My 1972 Surplus T serial number  On my 1968 T247679, firing pin block, probably 2nd quarter 1968, lines hard not well marked  On the foot of the barrel, hard to see again, but appears to be 3rd quarter of 1968  |
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Post by dirtniron on Sept 5, 2021 14:57:31 GMT -5
Thank you Todd for the detailed reply.
I was able to locate the original papers for this specific Hi Power #2859XX. The gun was bought new from a Norristown Pa. sporting goods store in July 1972. The operating booklet has a printing coded date of 6-69 for June 1969 I would think.
Without getting into the specific stampings I would think the gun was made in Belgium in late 1971 or early 1972 for distribution. Anyway i am relieved that the published serial number chart has errors.
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Post by cpwlew on Oct 4, 2021 21:32:56 GMT -5
As known, for unknown reasons FN used two serial number sequences after T258XXX. FN probably had a reason but I see no purpose to the 2 serial number sequences. I have 7 with serial numbers above T258XXX. Some are Browning marked & some are FN marked. Some have fixed sights, some have only tangent sights and some have both tangent sights and the stock slot. It is a shame we cannot get into the minds of the people at FN.
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Post by ToddSig on Oct 5, 2021 8:04:23 GMT -5
As known, for unknown reasons FN used two serial number sequences after T258XXX. FN probably had a reason but I see no purpose to the 2 serial number sequences. Welcome cpwlew. Would you please clarify the two serial number sequences for T series Hi Powers. Do you mean before T258XXX and after T258XXX or was there a different T series numbering sequence with specific T serial numbers? If so what # did it start with and when? As I previously posted, I have a T377390 with 1972 part production marks. Thanks. |
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Post by cpwlew on Oct 5, 2021 13:42:29 GMT -5
As known, for unknown reasons FN used two serial number sequences after T258XXX. FN probably had a reason but I see no purpose to the 2 serial number sequences. Welcome cpwlew. Would you please clarify the two serial number sequences for T series Hi Powers. Do you mean before T258XXX and after T258XXX or was there a different T series numbering sequence with specific T serial numbers? If so what # did it start with and when? As I previously posted, I have a T377390 with 1972 part production marks. Thanks. As you can see, I quote "FN used two serial number sequences 'after' T258XXX." Obviously, the two sequences are 'T' and 'C'. Like I also mentioned -- I have 7 with serial numbers above T258XXX. Some are Browning marked & some are FN marked. Some have fixed sights, some have only tangent sights and some have both tangent sights and the stock slot. Besides my 7 I have seen other ones with the 'T' prefix above T258xxx, I will add that there seems to be no pattern to the Browning marking or the FN marking or whether the pistol has fixed sights, tangent sights or have both tangent sights and the stock slot. Also, I will add that there does not seem to be a break in the 'T' serial numbering. Of course, there is a gap between T258xxx and the lowest 'T' serial number observed above that. |
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Post by ToddSig on Oct 5, 2021 14:52:43 GMT -5
Welcome cpwlew. Would you please clarify the two serial number sequences for T series Hi Powers. Do you mean before T258XXX and after T258XXX or was there a different T series numbering sequence with specific T serial numbers? If so what # did it start with and when? As I previously posted, I have a T377390 with 1972 part production marks. Thanks. As you can see, I quote "FN used two serial number sequences 'after' T258XXX." Obviously, the two sequences are 'T' and 'C'. Like I also mentioned -- I have 7 with serial numbers above T258XXX. Some are Browning marked & some are FN marked. Some have fixed sights, some have only tangent sights and some have both tangent sights and the stock slot. Besides my 7 I have seen other ones with the 'T' prefix above T258xxx, I will add that there seems to be no pattern to the Browning marking or the FN marking or whether the pistol has fixed sights, tangent sights or have both tangent sights and the stock slot. Also, I will add that there does not seem to be a break in the 'T' serial numbering. Of course, there is a gap between T258xxx and the lowest 'T' serial number observed above that. Thanks, I got you now. The T series, followed by the C series which had the two digit year prefix The C series was later followed by the 245 prefix series, and then the 510/511 prefixes. For some reason I was thinking you were referring to two separate series of numbers within the T series serial numbers of Hi Powers. |
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Post by cpwlew on Oct 5, 2021 22:35:57 GMT -5
As you can see, I quote "FN used two serial number sequences 'after' T258XXX." Obviously, the two sequences are 'T' and 'C'. Like I also mentioned -- I have 7 with serial numbers above T258XXX. Some are Browning marked & some are FN marked. Some have fixed sights, some have only tangent sights and some have both tangent sights and the stock slot. Besides my 7 I have seen other ones with the 'T' prefix above T258xxx, I will add that there seems to be no pattern to the Browning marking or the FN marking or whether the pistol has fixed sights, tangent sights or have both tangent sights and the stock slot. Also, I will add that there does not seem to be a break in the 'T' serial numbering. Of course, there is a gap between T258xxx and the lowest 'T' serial number observed above that. Thanks, I got you now. The T series, followed by the C series which had the two digit year prefix The C series was later followed by the 245 prefix series, and then the 510/511 prefixes. For some reason I was thinking you were referring to two separate series of numbers within the T series serial numbers of Hi Powers. The T series and the C series co-existed for a few years. So the C series did not entirely follow the T series. |
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