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Post by dmac on Feb 15, 2023 18:13:23 GMT -5
I recently received a Pre-War High Power from a family member. After much research, I do not have a clue on year of manufacture or any other history on this pistol. There was no history given to me by the family. Looking for help. I tried to attach Photos attached for reference but it won't let me ? Thanks !!
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Post by dmac on Feb 15, 2023 18:28:56 GMT -5
Sorry here are some pictures
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Post by dmac on Feb 15, 2023 18:32:36 GMT -5
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Post by ToddSig on Feb 15, 2023 19:50:07 GMT -5
Welcome to HPC dmac. You have something special there, one of the early 1933/34 Belgian Military oval port Grand Rendement High Powers. Only 1,100 made for Belgian army testing and to find the best options for a shoulder stock, magazine pouch and holsters. The last one to sell at Rock Island was for nearly $13000 (better condition), link is www.rockislandauction.com/detail/87/1370/belgian-military-trials-fn-grand-rendementhighpower-pistolWhat makes it special besides the date is the oval ejection port. The proof marks are as follows: - The E over GB over *, is the Belgian government proof, this arsenal mark reveals the parts past inspection and were part of the Belgian State
- H within a circle, inspectors parts acceptance, arsenal mark found on High Powers between 1931 and 1939
- Lion stick figure over PV, Leige proof, Lion stands for Belgium, PV for smokeless powder
- * over P, this is an FN inspector mark, but the books show this mark for an inspector working between 1952 and 1960. They must not know who it was assigned to previously
- Crown over PH, another arsenal mark on High Powers between 1935-1940 (dates may not be correct for the very early High Powers (the Rock Island example has a similar mark)(edit, according to Vanderlinden, these trial Grand Rendement High Powers were later used as service pistols, and it is possible to find later applied arsenal proofs if it was stored, repaired or overhauled in an arsenal.)
A great, rare High Power, Please share a few more images of each side as well as the top of the slide so we can see the tangent sight marks. Also, what is the family history of the pistol?
Thanks for sharing, we have recently seen some great early Belgian contract High Powers.
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Post by dmac on Feb 15, 2023 20:26:03 GMT -5
Hey ToddSig, Thanks for the awesome information ! I will send a few more pictures. Don't know a lot about the history, just that my great Uncle who was in the European theater brought it home after the war ? I didn't take a pic , but when I removed one of the grips down in the corner the 550 was stamped on the frame.
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Post by dmac on Feb 15, 2023 20:29:42 GMT -5
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Post by dmac on Feb 15, 2023 21:23:49 GMT -5
Do you exactly when it was made , and is that the original Magazine ? Thanks ! Attachments:
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Post by ToddSig on Feb 16, 2023 9:13:32 GMT -5
A couple additional comments. The small A within a square which is on several parts is an FN pre war final inspection mark for quality control.It was used from the early 1930s to 1940. I have added a note to one of the earlier bullet points to clarify a later mark, post production, Crown over PH, another arsenal mark on High Powers between 1935-1940 (dates may not be correct for the very early High Powers (the Rock Island example has a similar mark)(edit, according to Vanderlinden, these trial Grand Rendement High Powers were later used as service pistols, and it is possible to find later applied arsenal proofs if it was stored, repaired or overhauled in an arsenal.)Vanderlinden notes 16 known examples of the late Belgian trials Grand Rendement High Power. Your contract/serial number of 550 is not listed. Many examples found had in the white hammers, yours looks blued, but could have been done later at the arsenal. There is no specific dates for the Grand Rendement Belgian military trial pistols listed beyond "produced for Belgian military field trials in 1933-1934". Perhaps there is another member who knows something about these early oval port Belgian military trail late Grand Rendement High Power pistols. Another option is for you to reach out directly to Anthony Vanderlinden, author of FN Browning Pistols, which is where I found most of the information on your High Power. I know he has communicated with other High Power collectors in the past, and finding and documenting another Grand Rendement I would think would be of interest to him. Link to his contact page on his website www.fnbrowning.com/contactPlease keep us posted if you find out additional information on this rare High Power.
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Post by dmac on Feb 16, 2023 12:00:38 GMT -5
Thanks again, that is all great info. I will keep you posted if I find anything else out on my end .
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Post by dmac on Feb 16, 2023 17:43:05 GMT -5
Here are a couple of pictures proof marks of under the handles.
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Post by dmac on Feb 16, 2023 22:54:56 GMT -5
I would like to get a original shoulder stock/holster for this gun, any ideas ??
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Post by ToddSig on Feb 17, 2023 9:53:58 GMT -5
From all of the images of the various proof and inspector marks, what is observed is the marks are consistent on most/all of the parts when marked. The same inspectors and marks show parts are original and belong together for an excellent example of the period. marks, numbers, oval port, etc are also consistent with what has been recorded by experts and specialists. With that, I think you can feel very good about the overall originality of the complete Belgian trials Grand Rendement High Power. Forgotten Weapons has a youtube video on the Grand Rendement, it focuses on an earlier, fixed sight version, but he does mention the Belgian trail pistols toward the end. Keep in mind, the Belgian trial pistols were pretty much the same as the P35 production pistols with the exception of the oval ejection port. Earlier Rendement models were different than the trails version, which was the last Rendement model before the P35. Link to the video www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KxwOQUCgxMRegarding the shoulder stock, from what I understand, the Belgian military trials of the Grand Rendement/High Power were actually testing for compatibility and utility for shoulder stocks. So there were probably various styles tested. What was adopted for the Belgian military was a flat board with no leather holster. (see image below) Original shoulder stocks for pre war high powers are going to difficult to find and very expensive. As Chuck has noted on an earlier pre war Belgian military contract High Power thread, there are not only many reproductions, but also counterfeit stocks being sold as original. You might have to settle for a repro stock. You might wish to touch base with a few dealers who specialize in pre war and WWII firearms and weapons. Two that come to mind are Simpson and Pre 98 Antiques, both will be expensive. Perhaps some other forum members can recommend additional dealers to contact. They should also be able to discuss with you the potential availability. simpsonltd.com/pre98.com/Image of pre war Belgian contract flat board, no holster attached shoulder stock. I would think this shoulder stock pattern would be the closest to an original example for your Grand Rendement. Sounds like you plan on keeping the the Grand Rendement. That is great. I would recommend you then purchase Vanderlinden's book, which will have all of this information. www.fnbrowning.com/book-fn-browning-pistols-3rd-editio
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Post by dmac on Feb 17, 2023 13:04:18 GMT -5
I assume that this gun would fall under C&R status with the ATF ? Do you know if a re-production stock would be an NFA item , or would it be exempt from a tax stamp and SBR status ? Thanks a gain for the info !
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Post by dmac on Feb 17, 2023 13:17:27 GMT -5
Yes, I do plan on keeping it for now. I am mostly Colt & Winchester collector , especially 1911's and military arms and accessories. But this is a super cool item .
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Post by ToddSig on Feb 17, 2023 18:12:18 GMT -5
Glad you plan on keeping it and it appears it will fit well with you military arms collection as well. Yes, the age of the pistol makes it C&R eligible. I do believe adding a reproduction shoulder stock would require stamps etc to comply with NFA as it is a change or addition. I am not an expert on this, and I know there has been some debate/discussions and cautions on High powers and existing vs adding shoulder stocks. I am sure someone with more knowledge on the subject will post with guidance and opinions.
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