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Post by tnorris on Mar 3, 2019 21:42:35 GMT -5
tnorris, please note that FM Models 90 and 95 ARE NOT licensed copies of the BHP. My experience is limited to a 9mm FM M90 frame assembly and an FN .40 slide assembly. That combo would not cycle a round. In order to use a 9mm BHP slide on a .40 BHP frame, the .40 ejector blade would have to be changed to the thinner 9mm unit.
MightyMouse and CXM,
Gotcha. From Mr Camps book:
"Hi Power frames are identical for both the 9mm and .40 Hi Powers but the .40's ejector is slightly thicker at 0.075". Not surprisingly, the ejector groove visible at the rear of the slide is slightly wider for the heavier caliber. The 9mm ejector is thinned from that dimension to 0.051" on the top portion that is visible from the frame."
Though the FM90s and FM95s are not licensed copies, I wonder how different in materials, strength, dimension and what not they are from the last of the licensed copies.
I have 6 Hi Powers, one in .40 cal. My first 9 & .40 were interchangeable back in 2005. The FM Detective slide and .22 Ceiner Kit also worked well with them and the other two FNs. My Tisas and FEG are both problem children in some ways.
It seems I need to take them all to the range real soon and see what really works with what... not a bad thing!
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Post by mightymouse on Mar 4, 2019 14:00:38 GMT -5
The key difference, for the purpose of this discussion, between licensed FM BHP copies and the M90/95 is that the frame of the M90/95 uses a wider ejector blade. This means that the slide of a 9mm licensed copy will not fit on the BHP .40 frame, or the M90/95 series frame for that matter (unless one installs the thinner 9mm ejector blade first).
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Post by sams1 on Mar 5, 2019 17:35:07 GMT -5
Went to the Range today to try the FM95 9mm/BHP 40 combos...
Range Report:
1. For me it was the first time shooting the stock Argentine FM M95 Classic 9mm since I received it a few days ago. It was a joy to shoot just as it would be with a standard 9mm BHP. Smooth as silk, no hiccups and very accurate!
2. FM M95 Classic HP,9mm Slide assembly (complete assy) mounted on a Browning HP .40 cal Frame: as mightymouse indicated, this combo worked great - as if all the parts were meant to mate and work together! Again, smooth as silk, fun and very accurate - zero issues! if I didn't know the slide and frame are 'hybrid' of two very different guns, I would have never felt any different from a stock BHP.
3. I tried the reverse as well - i.e mounting the BHP .40 Slide assembly on the stock M95 frame. Here, unlike mightymouse' experienced, I had only one instance of failure to feed (on the third round) and thereafter no issues at all and again, this hybrid gun ran and felt as normal as a .40 cal BHP does. Ran only one box of 50 rounds (.40 cal) in this configuration.
Sam
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Post by mightymouse on Mar 5, 2019 20:43:30 GMT -5
Sam, I am delighted to read your range report! As you may know, Cylinder and Slide turned out a few 9mm/.40 BHP conversions using a custom, three lug barrel, that had the outside dimensions of the stock BHP .40 barrel (so that it could be used with the .40 slide), but that was rifled and chambered for the 9mm round. (With its three lug lockup and extra thick barrel, plus the .40 cast frame and heavier slide, this was meant to be a "heavy-duty" High Power, suitable for heavy use of +P ammo.) Other than this custom approach, there was no way of easily converting a .40 HP to 9mm, short of swapping ejectors.
That is the reason I posted my experiences here, because it is an easy conversion to make, if one already has, or soon will have, a FM M90/95 slide assembly to spare. I am glad the conversion worked so well for you. I am also surprised that the reverse combo worked so well, as it is the opposite of my experience. Enjoy your new 9mm conversion for the .40 BHP!
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Post by sams1 on Mar 5, 2019 23:02:56 GMT -5
As you said - this conversion would make sense if one has a spare M90/95 slide laying around.
I didn't know about C&S 9mm barrel conversion for the 40 slide - too bad they stopped offering it.
Also, I'm quite intrigued by Tnorris' quote from Steven Camp's authoritative book that the 9mm and 40 cal frame are identical. The 'common knowledge' is that the 40 cal frame is made of the stronger (than forged) cast steel so to handle the higher stress caused by the 40 cal round. Of course, he may have meant that they are identical dimensionally, which is, of course, correct.
Thanks much, Sam
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Post by CXM on Mar 6, 2019 8:03:53 GMT -5
I have to disagree with Steven on this one... Whilst the frames on 9mm HPs contemporary to the HP40 are the same older frames are not... The forged frame HPs had problems with using 40SAW ammo which led to the cast frame guns which are stronger. FWIW CHuck tnorris, please note that FM Models 90 and 95 ARE NOT licensed copies of the BHP. My experience is limited to a 9mm FM M90 frame assembly and an FN .40 slide assembly. That combo would not cycle a round. In order to use a 9mm BHP slide on a .40 BHP frame, the .40 ejector blade would have to be changed to the thinner 9mm unit. MightyMouse and CXM,
Gotcha. From Mr Camps book:
"Hi Power frames are identical for both the 9mm and .40 Hi Powers but the .40's ejector is slightly thicker at 0.075". Not surprisingly, the ejector groove visible at the rear of the slide is slightly wider for the heavier caliber. The 9mm ejector is thinned from that dimension to 0.051" on the top portion that is visible from the frame." Though the FM90s and FM95s are not licensed copies, I wonder how different in materials, strength, dimension and what not they are from the last of the licensed copies. I have 6 Hi Powers, one in .40 cal. My first 9 & .40 were interchangeable back in 2005. The FM Detective slide and .22 Ceiner Kit also worked well with them and the other two FNs. My Tisas and FEG are both problem children in some ways.
It seems I need to take them all to the range real soon and see what really works with what... not a bad thing!
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Post by bmcgilvray on Mar 6, 2019 23:42:30 GMT -5
The .357SIG conversion is kinda exciting to consider for the High Power pistol. The .357SIG is everything the 9mm is cracked up to be, yet isn't.
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Post by mightymouse on Mar 7, 2019 20:17:12 GMT -5
The idea behind the .357 SIG was to replicate .357 Magnum ballistics (specifically the famous 125 grain JHP load) in an auto pistol. It was never a direct competitor of the 9mm, as it was considerably hotter from the get-go.
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Post by sams1 on Mar 7, 2019 21:58:08 GMT -5
I agree, mightymouse. The 357 Sig was not developed to compete with the 9mm. It is, however, a hot and 'mean' hard-hitting bullet, especially if you are on the receiving end... The biggest and unexpected surprise for me was how enjoyable to shoot and how accurate this round is. As everyone knows, the BHP in 9mm is by itself a real fun shooting gun that runs and runs like a Singer sewing machine. I find this to be nearly the same with the BHP in .357 Sig albeit with marginally stronger recoil. Next for me is to put the longer (6") .357 Sig barrel in and see how this baby shoots...
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Post by gunhand on Jun 10, 2019 10:32:53 GMT -5
I have one .40 S&W HP, and I'm working on a trade for another. I will be looking into the .357 Sig conversion for sure. As a retired federal agent, I happen to have several thousand rounds of Speer Gold Dot 125 gr. .357 Sig ammo. I have a Glock 32, and a S&W M&P .40 with the factory .357 Sig barrel. I love the .357 Sig cartridge for the same reason that the U.S. Secret Service issues it, it's a really great performing pistol round. I will probably keep one of my HP's as a dedicated .357 Sig pistol.
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Post by scattershot on Jul 1, 2019 17:05:43 GMT -5
I have a .40 Practical model, and I switch back and forth between .40 and 9mm with just a barrel swap and the appropriate magazines. Works great.
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